Updated Nov 29, 2012 - 1:17 pm

Should the Mariners make a splash?

By Shannon Drayer

I planned on writing about some "what if" scenarios for the Mariners today and then came across Dave Cameron's piece on U.S.S. Mariner which summed up just about everything I wished most folks already knew when they asked me about the latest Mariners rumors. The post is a great explanation of just where a lot of the rumors we hear this time of year in particular come from. If you are a fan of hot stove baseball he points to certain things you should keep in mind when hearing about certain players being tied to certain teams. Good stuff. If you have a few minutes please give it a read.

As for the "what ifs", I wanted to get your thoughts on some things. The Mariners have money to spend this year but it is a rather thin free-agent market. It doesn't appear that there will be any buyer-friendly deals for the M's with any of the top 10 names. The Mariners will most likely will have to overspend to get one of those players and honestly, that's okay. Top free agents in any given year get top dollars. Some years the top free agents are better than the top free agents in other years but regardless, those at the top in any given year are going to get top dollar.

David Wright could be an option for the M's if the Mets don't retain him. (AP)

We are hoping that Jack Zduriencik will be able to make a good trade or two in the next couple of months but obviously, that is not completely in his control. A little bit more, but still not completely in his control, is who he spends his money on. The player has to be willing to come to Seattle and sometimes that may take a little extra. Who do you reach for if you are the Mariners and you have to spend that money?

Mike Napoli may or may not have a team willing to go three years with him. If he does, do you go four or even five? If that is the best bat available to you that you know you can bring to Seattle, how far do you go for him?

According to various reports, the Red Sox have had ongoing negotiations with Nick Swisher. That could be a tough bidding war to find yourself in. Do you do something bold to try to avoid that?

No one knows what the market for Josh Hamilton is. Someone could make a huge splash at the winter meetings next week or his market could be even slower to develop. What is your limit for Hamilton and do you re-think that if it appears you may not be able to get anything else big done?

One last scenario: what if the Mets cannot get a deal done with David Wright and decide to trade him? What if you could pull off a Cliff Lee-like deal for him? Lee was relatively cheap at $8 million the year he pitched for the Mariners and none of the players Zduriencik gave up have come back to haunt them. Wright is scheduled to earn $16 million this year. Would you take him at that salary for one year if you still had the money shortly after the winter meetings?

Do you not spend that money and gamble that you can get a deal done that will bring in established players? You can only do that if you still have money left to spend.

At some point the Mariners will have to do something bold to bring the bat they want via free agency to Seattle. Give it some thought. Are you comfortable doing that with a player that is currently available this year? Are you willing to roll the dice that a big name will actually be available in trade?

Is there someone on the market that you would be willing to make a splash for? How far would you go?

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rodman wrote...

Gotta spend money to make money

November 29, 2012 11:02 am

I don't think they should be scared off by the $8 million they have to pay Figgins. Any player worth his salt that is going to make an impact is going to cost at least $15 million per year. That's what the going rate is. Gotta get over it and dive in. You hit on some, you lose some. But you at least have to play to win. We have got plenty of dough. The fans deserve it.

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vbnut wrote...

Two moves a must

November 29, 2012 11:52 am

To have impact, this team needs to make 2 significant moves to add to the middle of the order. There are 3 positions where that can easily happen, C, SS, and RF. Granted that Napoli would be an ideal 1-2 year solution for waiting on Zunino. Given that Boston wins this, we don't have much choice other than a possible trade with Toronto. As many FAs use the freedom to specify choice, there aren't many who would come to a team that has lost 90-100 games so consistently. No solutions there. The first trade option would seem to be with Cleveland, picking up Choo and Cabrera for a package looking like Erasmo, Beavan, Noesi, and Ryan. That alone should make us a much more competitive team capable of high 80's to low 90's in wins. That also gives us 2 players who we are more likely to be able to sign up again. That doesn't give us the big hammer, but that could come next year with Mauer unless we can get him in a trade this year. Alternatively, we can hope for Zunino to make the roster by mid-year.

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ManagerMaterial wrote...

The M's need a splash ....and so does Jack

November 29, 2012 12:22 pm

The M's need to make the splashy deal and better sooner than later. My personal pick would be to get Billy Butler for an appropriate package of current players and prospects and then go sign Swisher as a free agent. Under this scenario, we live with Montero and Jaso as catchers until Zunino shows up, have Butler as primary DH, and play Swisher in right field if Smoak plays the way he did at the end of last year, or Swisher on first if he doesn't. If you can't pry Butler out of KC, go ahead and sign Hamilton, but no more than 4 years. Also, about Jack. The luster is starting to fade on the legend of "Trader Jack". First, he needs to make a deal. Standing pat or making minor irrelevant moves means that virtually everything has to break the Mariners way for team success in the AL West as well as for the prospects of Jack keeping his job. That means improved production from Smoak, Ackley, and Gutierrez plus no regression from Seagar, Montero, Vargas, Iwakuma, Wilhelmson, and Saunders. It also means no significant injuries. Would you bet your job on that? Assuming that Jack does make a "deal", then that deal has to work (no more Figgins like deals). Bottom line - this is a make or break signing / trading season for the Mariners........and for Jack. The risk of standing pat (or marginal, uninspiring additions) is much higher than making a deal. Come on, Jack - we're tired of hearing "it takes two to trade". Step up and get something done.

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Harry Johnson wrote...

Save our Money

November 29, 2012 1:48 pm

Let's just save our money. We traded for Beltre and his side kick on first base because they were "Big Bats." Let's face it. Big Bats don't like living here because it's to far from home. We have some really good players coming down the pike. We should bank our money on them. Then when someone special pokes his head up, go get 'em. Hamilton and/or Swisher just won't help much. Maybe a game or two that's all. Just one more question. Are the Yankees' salivating for Felix? I'm sure Lincoln would love to trade him for a couple of draft prospects.

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finman1966 wrote...

Can they afford not to?

November 29, 2012 2:00 pm

The problem with this team is leadership, not Jack Z but with Armstrong and Lincoln. The concept of trying to make a profit on the cheap has blown up in their face as evidenced by the fact they have they have lost more fans than any other North American sports franchise over the last 10 years. They are going to hold onto this team until the new TV contract can be negotiated, then probably sell. At least I hope they do. If they really are committed, and want to compete, one impact bat won't do the trick- not in this division. They can make the trade for Wright and sign both Hamilton and Swisher. Then, we might able to talk about them contending. Look at the Tigers- they have both Miggy and Fielder, the Angels had Trout, Pujols and others, the Rangers had Hamilton, Beltre and Napoli, and the list goes on and on. Just one bat is not going to cut it. Get two or three, then we can talk.

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kellysplanet wrote...

Hold fast

November 29, 2012 2:32 pm

Shannon spoke of "What if's" I'm not a big what if person but what if the M's would of just held fast in the past and just drafted a little wiser? What if they would have never traded away Fister, Jones, Tillman, Choo and Cabrera for scrubs? What if they drafted Ryan Braun and Tim Lincecum instead of Clemment and Morrow? Imagine having a line-up with Ackley, Seager, Jones, Braun, Montero, Smoak, Cabrera, Jaso and Choo/Saunders in right field. A rotation of Felix, Fister, Vargas, Iwakuma and Tillman. That line-up is a contender. The M's dont know how to trade. They have proven that over and over again. And they also sign FA's that historically dont do well. I say quit trading your prospects and draft well and we will be fine. I knew trading Adam Jones and Tillman was a mistake from the beginning as was the trading of Fister. I swear I believe I could be a better GM the Bavasi or Jack Z!

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ronzilla wrote...

The M's owners are worthless ne'er-do-wells.

November 29, 2012 5:33 pm

The M's will continue to SUCK until new ownership takes place. It's a FACT. SORRY to tell you.
Thank GOD Ichiro is gone!

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honus w wrote...

Wil Myers and Nick Swisher

November 29, 2012 7:30 pm

I would overspend if I had to on Swisher and would strongly persue a trade for Myers. Something similar to the Pineda/Montero deal. Whatever it takes in both cases. It's now or never for Jack Z.

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soo purletiv wrote...

Swisher is a big mouth

November 29, 2012 10:44 pm

but he backs it up with "decent" numbers.
My "guess" is the Yankees keep him for nothing, compared to the FA market.
However, the FA market has shocked many of us in the past. Keep in mind, why would Swisher want to come to Seattle when he is loved in NY? Money aside! And why would Seattle throw more at him than New York?
Young power is what Seattle needs. Napoli, Hamilton.... are just gap stops but not fixes. They will all fade with time and be our next Figgins/Sexson et al.
BJ Upton with his continual rise in power numbers minus the SO figures was a good fit for the M's. The Braves scored big with this decent to higher than average player.
Seattle has the pitching for the coming years. What they don't have, and refuse to acquire is power hitting.
And the beat goes on........

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ThirteenOfTwo wrote...

Haha, no

November 29, 2012 11:04 pm

New York is trying to get under the luxury tax in 2014 and will likely not even offer Swisher a multi-year contract, let alone keep him for nothing. The idea that the Mariners necessarily need power hitting is a bad joke. First off, you don't necessarily need power hitting. There are plenty of ways to score runs. Second--and this may come as a shock to you--the Mariners are already pretty adept with the long ball. We can agree that it's hard to hit dingers in Safeco, right? Well, the Mariners in 2012 hit more road home runs than all but seven other teams. It's not the hitters' fault Safeco is ridiculous, and the fences are coming in, and Montero/Smoak can only improve, and Zunino and Franklin have home run power... the "power hitters" you speak of are already here.

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Your Vibe wrote...

agreed

November 30, 2012 12:03 am

Exactly what I was going to say. The power is already here and young. 20+ HR potential at 1b, 2b, 3b, SS, C, CF and DH. Again it's just corner outfield. The need for a bat is there this year for a corner outfielder. Not in a couple years as much as now. Taking pressure off those young bats can help us to have the power we need in coming years. With the pitching and defense on the team and in the high minors we don't need a murderers row. Our pitching and defense is far superior to the 27 Yankees, or they'd have won more than 110 games. Wright signed, so no option there anymore. Choo might be a good target though.

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Stevil wrote...

^

December 2, 2012 4:07 pm

NY made it clear they intend to limit, or eliminate, the luxury tax damage by avoiding long-term deals. Seattle is in greater need of a corner outfielder and has the dough, so it shouldn't be a surprise if we see them make a harder play for Swisher than NY. Worth noting his numbers are more than just "decent" (who were you quoting?!). He has a pretty impressive career line. Good walk rate, hits a ton of doubles, over 20 home runs every year, OPS well over .800, plays two positions. He's a better fit than Upton would have been.

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Sprig65 wrote...

Please NO

November 30, 2012 8:19 am

Please don't let a week free agent market make the M's do something stupid like Hamilton or Nick Swisher. If you take Swisher out of Yankee Stadium and out of a line up like the Yankees have, his numbers will fall off the cliff. There is no way anyone can think he can carry a line up! He is a complementary player at best and we just sent the Yankees one of those. Go after Laroche as a free agent. He is left handed should continue to produce 280 ave with 20 plus HR. Put Smoak at Tacoma and let him get motivated to get his marshmellow body in shape and put a chip on his shoulder. Don't give him and out and trade him elswhere. Then Trade Walker and Vargas for Buttler. This is not "dream senario" KC is likely to make that trade. If you need to throw in another minor league guy then do it. Now you have a 1B that can hit. A DH that can hit. Let Montero catch. That is what he is. A catcher. He is not great back there, but not so bad you can live with it. Keep Jaso as the back up and and wait for Zininno. Napoli is done. Whoever signs him is getting a broke down old catcher with injury issues. We should learn that if the best manager in Baseball Mike Soshia (sp) does not want a player back, there is a reason for it. I am so tired of people saying make a splash sign somebody spend some money! Who Who Who! Don't do something stupid. Do you think the drop off in Hamilton was not due to his substance issues. Come on, how niave to you have to be. 150 million for guy who might last 2 or 3 more years. No way. I like Hamilton and admere that he came back, but the life he led has taken years off his body and career. Texas got lucky in the trade and that ship has sailed. Pay for the futer not the past. Steve

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Your Vibe wrote...

Pay for the future?

November 30, 2012 11:24 am

It sounds more like you're saying pay with the future. Walker ++ for a DH? Montero has nothing to learn with the bat at AAA. Smoak has nothing to learn with the bay at AAA. You want to go after a DH and 1b sending one of the best hitters on the team down while, what, running some combo of Peguero and Wells in the corners again. No thanks. Carp is not an outfielder for any regularity. Gutierrez can not be counted in to stay healthy and I feel the same way about carp as an outfielder. The needs are in LF and RF,, not 1b and DH. And don't call other people stupid then post illogical ideas. I'll bet Hamilton gets less than $150 million anyway.

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Your Vibe wrote...

oops

November 30, 2012 11:33 am

I missed that you were saying Montero it's a catcher. Montero will cease to be a catcher once Zunino is up. With your proposed acquisitions that leaves nowhere for Montero to go. Any player might have 0 more games left. You take that chance with any contract. I don't know what you men when you sayHamilton has dropped off. Maybe you don't understand age arcs or career years. I personally don't say they need to sign people every year. This team should sign someone this year.

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Updated Nov 29, 2012 - 1:17 pm

Should the Mariners make a splash?

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