Updated Dec 17, 2012 - 12:02 am

Final notes on Hamilton

By Shannon Drayer

A few more things on Josh Hamilton and then I think it is time to put it to rest.

Greg Johns of MLB.com reports that Jack Zduriencik made a "substantial offer" to Josh Hamilton. Ryan Divish of the News Tribune writes that the offer was for four years, $100 million with vesting options for a fifth and sixth year. Certainly substantial but obviously not enough. Hamilton apparently preferred a guaranteed fifth year in Anaheim to the possibility of six in Seattle. Read into that what you want. Didn't want to come to Seattle, wasn't confident he could stay healthy for six years? Only he knows.

The deal offered some protection for the Mariners but Hamilton had the luxury of not having to take it. Smart deal, didn't matter. For the record, I am okay with that. I also wouldn't have been upset if he had taken it. That offer, to me seemed just right for this player and this organization. It was substantial, it wasn't above and beyond, it offered protection to the club. In the end it probably didn't matter. If the Mariners had matched Anaheim with the guaranteed fifth year I would have to think that with everything we have heard about Hamilton's preferences he still would have chosen the Angels. Were you prepared to go six years/$150 million guaranteed? Would the Angels balk at that price tag?

Zduriencik still has money to spend. We will see if he is as aggressive on any other free agent front. The Rangers also have money to spend and very well could have similar targets. For all the talk of the crazy money the Dodgers and Angels have been spending with their TV deals it is interesting to see Texas, another team with a huge television deal and dollars to spend, strike out at every turn. As it stands they have around $100 million in payroll commitments in 2013 depending on what happens with their arbitration-eligible players.

Again, there are pieces out there that could help the Mariners and Zduriencik has money to spend. Perhaps in the long run there is more value in a couple of pieces rather than one big one. The names out there aren't as sexy but they could be better fits. In the end it is all about the results and we will see how this plays out.

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Breadguy wrote...

Hamilton would have been....

December 14, 2012 4:18 pm

Nice, but not at the price he received. I want the M's to spend big on the right players, but Hamilton would need more help, and if the M's couldn't bring in that additional help it is better to let him go. I'm good with Swisher/Bourne, but the M's still need another bat. At least those 2 players are not as high risks as Hamilton and they do come a little cheaper and allow for more additions. Not sure where the M's should go if they acquire on of the two, Swisher/Bourne, or both, but I want to see improvement! I want to be able to feel good about coming to the ballpark and seeing a good competitive game and feel there is a strong chance to win when I go! The wife and I went to 7 games 2 years ago and the M's lost every single one of them!!! Last year it was more of a split in wins/losses of games we attended..... Just give us some hope Jack Z...and hopefully the owners, Lincoln, and Armstrong give you more to work with next year!!!

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Breadguy wrote...

How come.....

December 14, 2012 4:19 pm

My posts never appear as different paragraphs? They always appear as one long paragraph, even though I separate them out properly.......

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Rayvensdad wrote...

Breadguy...

December 14, 2012 5:03 pm

You need to type the () symbol at the point where you want a new paragraph. That'll help with you wanting multiple paragraphs. No spaces in between. So it pretty much looks like this () just without the parentheses.

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Rayvensdad wrote...

Well... dang it...

December 14, 2012 5:05 pm

That didn't work. Breadguy, my post to you was distorted because the system thought i meant something else. Here is another explanation. You need to type the "arrow going left" button (same key as the comma). Then right after it, put a "p" then follow it with an arrow going right (period button). This will give you your next paragraph.

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Pilate wrote...

Breadguy/Paragraphs

December 15, 2012 8:37 am

It's HTML. Google it and you'll get a list of tutorial sites that'll give you the basics for free.

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Lessmith50 wrote...

breadguy

December 17, 2012 7:26 am

you need to do with the letter P in between the . That will give you your paragraph.

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Lessmith50 wrote...

Breadguy

December 17, 2012 7:32 am

You need to put the letter P between the greater and less signs the signs above the period and comma on your keyboard. When I type them they dont show up here.

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deedubya wrote...

Free Agents

December 17, 2012 3:00 am

December 17, 2012 at 3:46 AMRating: (0) (0) Report abuseNow playing 2nd base and leading off for the Mariners.....Russell Wilson, proven winner, hard worker and a reason for a fan to come out to the ballpark. DH......Jim Thome. Let these guys come in for a year and show this team how to win with class. I know it sounds far fetched but signing any other "decent" free agents looks pretty hopeless, what do we got to lose except more Safeco field attendees. I would love to hire Thome for a year to teach Montero and Smoak how to hit!

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Newton wrote...

Jack Z and the word aggressive. Ahhh

December 14, 2012 4:23 pm

Jack is a salesman. He knows nothing about baseball.Mariners excusses by the millions program. How Jack built this team does takes skill of the wrong type. Jack will say anything so that its new and "improved". So an aggressive B/S er yes that works for me.

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Rayvensdad wrote...

Mother of god...

December 14, 2012 5:07 pm

You are a downer. Good thing for you those of us who read your rubbish can at least go smoke so pot so we can get away from you.

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bigguitarman wrote...

okay then

December 14, 2012 5:38 pm

Since that was exactly the offer I remember posting on a mariners forum I can't fault Jack for it. Frustrating as hell, still, but what can you do.

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Stevil wrote...

Filling Big Shoes

December 14, 2012 6:30 pm

I think it's worth noting that the Angels had a very productive year from Hunter last season. His WAR was notably higher than Hamilton's, so the Angles really didn't improve as greatly as many seem to think. They also lost Greinke and Haren, leaving a sizable hole in their rotation. There's still several question marks with their team.

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shannon drayer wrote...

Shoes

December 14, 2012 9:08 pm

Tough to deny they have a formidable lineup but your point about Hunter is valid. I would also throw this in, Hamilton vs. Angels at Rangers Park: .361/.403/.669/1.072. Hamilton vs. Angels at Angel Stadium: .260/.325/.440/.765. A .307 difference in OBP. I am not saying he is going to be a huge flop in Anaheim but you can't ignore the park factors. Angels Stadium was the second worst hitters' park in the AL last year, behind Seattle of course.

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Derrol_o wrote...

Angel Stadium

December 15, 2012 1:05 am

Is it still the same park also known as the Big A? I always thought that park was a hitter's park, no? As for Jack Z's offer of 4 years and $100 million offer, it's too bad they couldn't get it done for that. With the 7/175 numbers it wasn't so much the dollar amount per seaso that was the concern as much as the amount of years. At 4/100 the risk to reward would have been far more favorable. But still I can't help but keep looking at the A's as a prime example of how it can click without a big time talent like Hamilton. Bringing him in on a 4 year deal would have been nice but I gotta agree even then it might not have been the best fit or the best way to go. Hopefully a Plan B can materialize that works better. Bringing in Bourn and Swisher both might not be enough but at least it would make them better. Jeez, how frustrating can it be for Z to finally have money to spend and now nobody seems to want to take it?

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shannon drayer wrote...

West Coast

December 15, 2012 3:32 pm

4 of the bottom 5 are on the West Coast with the most hitter friendly park being Oakland coming in at 22. Marine layer not just a Seattle problem. http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/parkfactor

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Lessmith50 wrote...

Derrol_O

December 17, 2012 11:48 am

I answered your GM questions

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Stevil wrote...

@Shannon

December 15, 2012 7:23 am

Great point about park factors. All the more reason for people not to panic (yet). Hamilton is a great hitter, and the Angels absolutely have a potent line-up, but there's certainly some flags worth taking note of. It will be interesting to see how he performs for them. Hopefully some of these points will sooth a few nerves around Mariner-nation.

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Pilate wrote...

@Stevil

December 15, 2012 11:02 am

Shannon mentioned one "flag" in another of her posts on this, the fact that Hamilton didn't want to be "the man" wherever he went. I am not wishing anyone ill, but he might turn out to be a distraction, even a divisive element, in the clubhouse. I'm not sure who "the man" is in Anaheim. When the Angels came out at the beginning of last season with the "El Hombre" thing for Pujols, he publicly recoiled. Let's hope that the Angels are nothing more than watch parts in a box that management is shaking, hoping the parts will assemble themselves.

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Stevil wrote...

.307 difference

December 15, 2012 6:11 pm

I'm assuming you meant OPS.

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rodman wrote...

We will never win

December 14, 2012 8:30 pm

As long as players still think of Seattle as South Alaska, and until there is evidence to the players that bringing the fences in will actually help balls fly out of Safeco Field, we will never get free agents to come here unless we severely overpay--and even that might not work. Its great to think about building from within, but then players leave as soon as they become free agents. I can't imagine that Felix will re-sign unless we overpay. Why would he hang around here when we can't compete? Oh well, at least we can look forward to another year of boat races, the hat trick game, the bloopers reel and highlights from 18 years ago (1995) on the new big screen. Will there still be Ichi-Rolls served at the game?

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DawgDays wrote...

If we have a park that hurts long-ball hitters...

December 14, 2012 9:43 pm

...then maybe not landing long-ball hitters is a good thing. I would be OK with two contact guys with doubles power instead of one "big bat." The thing is, if that's what we can do, then we need to actually do it. Start with Swisher and/or Bourn, and we would cover some mighty big holes. The backup catcher doesn't have to be an expensive guy. Then lets see where we go.

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bugmenot1234 wrote...

Berkman + Swisher

December 14, 2012 10:38 pm

With what is remaining on the free agent market, I'd try to get Swisher on a 3-year deal with a vesting optional 4th year. Then sign Berkman to a 1-year deal with a 2nd year option.

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JBWilcox wrote...

Jason Bay

December 15, 2012 8:11 am

We don't need Hamilton. We got Bay! He will fit right in. His 20 RBI total should put him right about 3-4-5 in the lineup. His 120 BA also works right in. He will not be embarrassing any of the current guys. We can watch more futility again this year it looks like.

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maqman wrote...

The Angels lost more fWAR than they have signed

December 15, 2012 9:43 am

and Texas has lost far more. The AL West has gotten a bit more competitive.

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lowgere wrote...

Baseball economics

December 15, 2012 10:48 am

The free agent market isn't always about winning, it's also about "MARKETING"! The Angels have shown a propensity for good marketing, which has yet to translate to winning. I think free agency is a crapshoot for teams like the Mariners. Playing it conservatively makes financial sense, and the fact that they remain profitable only enhances the fan bases frustration. I don't see any difference between this off season and one's previous. Here's to the AL WORST Seattle Mariners, cellar dweller's for the 21st Century!

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Joe the Printer wrote...

M's will be fine...

December 16, 2012 11:43 pm

As much as I would have liked to see Hamilton a Mariner, 5-6 years is too much for a player like him. Don't forget he disappeared in the second half last year playing in a hitter's park like Texas in the summer. I like the road the M's are on. Young guys showed promise last year, and moving the fences in will be a plus for the offense. I am more concerned with some of our "fly-ball" pitchers, and how the fence move will affect them. Beavan and Vargas may not be in the rotation past July if they struggle.

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Updated Dec 17, 2012 - 12:02 am

Final notes on Hamilton

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