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Spokesmen for both Obama and Boehner said the two men agreed to not release details of the conversation, but emphasized that the lines of communication remain open. (AP Photo/Carolyn Kaster, File)

What they're really talking about

BY Dave Ross  on December 10, 2012 @ 7:56 am (Updated: 9:46 am - 12/10/12 )

Here's the CEO of General Electric, Jeff Immelt, demanding an end to the fiscal cliff tiff:

"We need to get this resolved. Now."

We need it resolved now. But who's "we?"

If you ask Americans, which is what Politico just did in its latest battleground poll, "Sixty-nine percent oppose raising taxes on small businesses that earn more than $250,000 a year."

Don't tax small business. And at the same time, "There is very little appetite for significant changes to entitlement. Sixty-four percent in our (Politico's) poll oppose raising the retirement age for social security."

So all this stuff about we need to do this and we need to do that, trying to figure out what we as ordinary Americans want is no help.

So the president and Speaker Boehner had that secret meeting at the White House Sunday. Do you think they were discussing Keynesian economics? You think they're going over Tim Geithner's spreadsheets?

My guess is they're going over an entirely different set of numbers. They're going over vote counts. They're trying to decide if there's a better chance of passing something with the current Congress or the new Congress. This is like Lincoln passing the 13th Amendment. They're going over how to buy that last we vote, and I mean "buy" in the best Lincolnian sense.

Lincoln's strategy was to abolish slavery now and handle equality later, they're going have to raise taxes on the rich now and handle spending later. If past is prologue, that second part should be wrapped up in about 100 years.

Dave Ross, KIRO Radio Talk Show Host
Dave Ross is co-host of The Ross & Burbank Show on KIRO Radio (weekdays 9-Noon) and never too far from the spotlight.
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Comments (45)


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  • ron prevost wrote...
    Nice analogy, Dave. .. EXCEPT Sales were freed during & after the Civil War.
    December 10, 2012 8:26 am
    And equity took another 100 years. ....... Which, it seems, if left to his own devices, Mr. Obama would put off spending and entitlement reforms.

    But if Obama and Boehner ARE talking these days, it's probably golf, not the fiscal cliff. ... When questions are asked, answers are readily given - just NOT to the questions being asked. .. Talking points rule the day and 'the base' must be served.

    Actually, the GOP HAS signaled compromise, BUT the president seems to think that is a point of weakness to be exploited, and fails to respond in kind.

    So, Dave. You're right that they are going over different sets of numbers. But it appears worse than that. Both sides are also using entirely different languages - and no translations can be found. .......... And unfortunately this crisis will be solved the same way slavery worked its way out. With vindictiveness and neglect. .. And with no Lincoln to offer either humanity or sanity.

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  • ron prevost wrote...
    typo - slaves, not sales.
    December 10, 2012 8:31 am
    ...
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  • logical open mind wrote...
    the American public has far too many selfish and uninformed people-ofcourse they dont want to cut entitlements
    December 10, 2012 8:46 am
    the are selfish and want the rich to give them money, the gov to give them $10 of gov but only pay $6 for it. I am embarresed for so many lemmings and plan to get dual citizenship and live in costa rice in less tha 5 years. Good luck slackers!!! Good Luck with your head in the sand!!!
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    Logical
    December 10, 2012 9:23 am
    And how much is it that you want to cut the US defense budget?Funny addressing other posters as "slackers" as it seems your leaving the country to dodge taxes.
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  • logical open mind wrote...
    I want to cut defense 15 to 20%, stop defending Europe and Japan-what would I surmise that i think defense spending can't be cut?
    December 10, 2012 9:41 am
    Not as much as not wanting to live in the US and watch it slowly crumble, weaken and turn away from the values that made the US so strong. The US wants to be average at best now-I liked it when we were exceptional. The welfare system is the future will run out of money and all heck will break loose.
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  • maplefish wrote...
    CBO Estimates
    December 10, 2012 10:35 am
    In the next 4 years there will be 105 Million Workers paying for 85 Million Non Workers. These figures DID NOT INCLUDE SS. If Welfare already hit the $1 TRILLION Mark how on earth can we sustain this kind of FAILURE??? Obama's only plan is to increase Tax on what HE has determined to be the Rich and cut some defense spending? Sorry Folks, but it aint gonna work. Tax increases on the rich runs the Government for 8 Days.
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  • Shplunker wrote...
    mess i duh
    December 10, 2012 12:04 pm
    Same old Dooshy argument from the left. You always call conservatives GREEDY (or in this case tax dodger) when all we want is to keep what we earn - While you don't see yourself as greedy, even while trying to TAKE more and more of what others earn.
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  • Chuck Gould wrote...
    The key: Changing course a few degrees now will make a huge difference in position down the road
    December 10, 2012 9:11 am
    We seriously need to cut entitlements.

    We seriously need to cut spending.

    We need to get everybody paying a reasonable amount toward the operation of our public agencies and social structure.

    It's no surprise that GE wants this fixed "now". They pay $ZERO income tax on billions of dollars income every year. Their version of "fixing this" is probably centered around ensuring that they don't lose all their loopholes under the current tax code.

    Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. "If you raise taxes on GE they will retaliate by laying people off!" Duh, seems to me that if there's a direct relationship between hiring and taxes, GE ought to be on a non-stop hiring spree. Oh wait, they are! In Malaysia, mainland China, India....

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  • logical open mind wrote...
    libs, the D party and unions is why companies have expanded overseas.
    December 10, 2012 9:40 am
    The good news is automation and robotics is allowing companies to move back to the US. However the jobs created by robotics are not for unskilled or uneducated workers. The day when unskilled workers could make a good living is gone and wont return.
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  • maplefish wrote...
    Ohh And Chuck
    December 10, 2012 10:38 am
    Tell us who is the head of Obama's Jobs Council????Hmmmmmmm? Why it's the CEO fo GE....Jeff Immelt. Who, I might add, already shipped 20,000 JOBS to CHINA. Hows that for blatant HYPOCRISY!
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  • Chuck Gould wrote...
    Pretty hypocritcal, maplefish
    December 10, 2012 10:47 am
    Obama's hypocrisy, and the hypocrisy of all politicians aside, I'm glad to see that you agree there is no correlation between the amount of taxes paid and the number of jobs created in the United States, (which was my point). GE pays NO INCOME TAX, ($ZERO) and, as you say, has shipped 20,000 jobs to China.
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  • maplefish wrote...
    Chuck
    December 10, 2012 10:54 am
    Good Point! But the 1835 new regualtions that Obama has thrown on business has not helped, neither has the $TRILLIONS of Wasted stimulous $$$ Oh, and Obama has sgipped around 10,00 GM jobs overseas as well....so much for saving the Auto industy.
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  • maplefish wrote...
    has "Shipped"
    December 10, 2012 11:00 am
    around 10,000 GM jobs
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  • Forrest wrote...
    Let's see...
    December 10, 2012 9:14 am
    We can raise the age of eligibility for Medicare and save $15 billion a year yet we want to continue fighting wars in Iraq and Afghanistan at $200 billion per year. Makes sense to me.
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  • logical open mind wrote...
    forest-read the papers we are leaving Iraq and Afgan-
    December 10, 2012 9:40 am
    where have u been?
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  • Forrest wrote...
    Reading the same news accounts
    December 10, 2012 10:08 am
    where Republicans are saying we are going home to early and need to stay.
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  • logical open mind wrote...
    read beloe re a liberal, white poor and the downside a dependency-read it -it is stunning!
    December 10, 2012 10:29 am
    THIS is what poverty sometimes looks like in America: "###parents here in Appalachian hill country pulling their children out of literacy classes. Moms and dads fear that if kids learn to read, they are less likely to qualify for a monthly check for having an intellectual disability."### Many people in hillside mobile homes here are poor and desperate, and a $698 monthly check per child from the Supplemental Security Income program goes a long way — and those checks continue until the child turns 18. “The kids get taken out of the program because the parents are going to lose the check,” said Billie Oaks, who runs a literacy program here in Breathitt County, a poor part of Kentucky. “It’s heartbreaking.”
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  • Forrest wrote...
    Sounds like real religious republicans from the south, logical open mind.
    December 10, 2012 12:49 pm
    If you can't understand science, try religion! Praise Jesus.
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  • logical open mind wrote...
    forest-what? pls explain your post
    December 10, 2012 1:16 pm
    I makes no sense. re-read my post re Kentucky poverty.
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  • Forrest wrote...
    Quoting logical open mind," I makes no sense".
    December 10, 2012 3:21 pm
    No you don't logical, we certainly agree on that.
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    Forrest
    December 10, 2012 10:44 am
    Raising the age of Medicare would also result in older workers staying on the job instead of retiring.
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  • cdbtx wrote...
    Cut..cut..cut
    December 10, 2012 9:19 am
    $167.00 equivalent in cash is spent per day for those on Welfare.... I'm willing to bet a large number of people here would find it far more profitable to be on welfare verses working..

    Not sure why.. but for some reason.. just doesn't seem like a logical path for lowering unemployment.. just may be my defective thinking...

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  • logical open mind wrote...
    In Pennsylvania a study showed a women with two kids would need to make $69K per year to equal what she gets in freebies.
    December 10, 2012 9:44 am
    and yet birth control is free all over the place at Planned Parenthood and other places. these women want to get knocked up-it beats working by a mile. Only thing is these woman by in large do a lousy job of turning their offspring into good hard working people-read or study this disaster.
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  • Chuck Gould wrote...
    cdbtx: Tilt! "$167 spent per day for those on Welfare..."
    December 10, 2012 9:58 am
    Where in blazes do you come up with stuff like that?

    What does your propaganda source consider "welfare"? Some of those guys over there in the right field bleachers are talking about Medicare, Social Security, Veteran's benefits, etc these days under the category of "welfare".

    The last "real life" case of which I became personally aware, last week, is a family of 8 political refugees partially supported by welfare. Their take? About $1100 per month. That's not even $167 per *month*, let alone per day, per person in that particular situation. Yes, we can be sure they're living so high off the hog on that lavish allotment that they will never be inspired to take a job cleaning toilets at $9 an hour.

    It would be useful for you to cite your source.

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  • logical open mind wrote...
    google $167 per day for welfare
    December 10, 2012 11:07 am
    The article has data from a Congreesional budget committee. Chuck-welfare isn't just one payment. Housing, food stamps, medicaid, WIC, and more. Quit pointing out anticdotal stories that we can't confirm or know the true details.
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    cdbtx
    December 10, 2012 10:47 am
    $167 ($60,955 a year) a day for each person on welfare? Do you have a link?I find that hard to believe
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  • Forrest wrote...
    Did anyone else notice...
    December 10, 2012 10:23 am
    Boner's skin is as dark if not darker than Obama's. Does the guy live in a tanning booth? Has his liver quite working? Maybe Boner's a want-to-be.
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  • ron prevost wrote...
    It's not a tanning booth - it's spray on.
    December 10, 2012 10:34 am
    It's better living through chemistry. :)
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    Ron P
    December 10, 2012 10:51 am
    Easy now,My Daddy and my Wife's Daddy were DuPont employees.
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    Forrest
    December 10, 2012 12:12 pm
    In the photo it appears that Boner was crying.It must hurt having those Tea Party crazies stuck up your butt 24hrs a day
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  • sportsguru wrote...
    messiah101
    December 10, 2012 5:28 pm
    lol, every now and then, you score big and that was a good one, my wife rarely bothers me when I am blogging and I laughed so loud she had to see what I was looking at and now she is darn near on the floor laughing, I had to show her the photo of Boner's face first for her to get the joke,lol. Oh boy
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  • DesertRez wrote...
    It's makes it easier
    December 10, 2012 10:58 am
    if you come to the realization that there is no solution to our fiscal insanity, and that politicians do not care. Remember, these are lawyers, not mathmeticians or accountants. Someday the house of cards will collapse and we will start all over clean (if you survive).
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  • maplefish wrote...
    DesertRez
    December 10, 2012 11:51 am
    You nailed it!It is easier! These idiots don't care. Obama won, the majority of the ignorant sheep in this country have been brainwashed into beliveing that Rich People are evil and that they dont deserve to keep the money they earned. Yep, Barry knows best and we all need to give more of money to mommy & daddy government. Instead of adressing the spending like any sane, resposible person, Obama actually BELIEVES he can spend his way to fiscal utopia. Like a drunken teenage girl with her daddy's credit card. So much for the pusuit of happiness....
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    DesertRez
    December 10, 2012 12:26 pm
    "No solution"? Of course their is,however it requires sacrifice from the American public.The middle class has contributed its YOUTH to protecting our nation now its time for the wealthy (Business) to contribute some of their wealth to assist our nation in paying off its debts (remember most of the debt is owed to ourselves 52%)We had a larger percentage of debt (in relation to our GDP) after WW2 113% then we have presently 72%,a solution was found at that time and a solution can be found now
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  • logical open mind wrote...
    once again messybrain is a fool. U simply cant take enough of the rich's money to make a dent in the debt.
    December 10, 2012 1:26 pm
    read, man read or learn to read!!
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    logical?
    December 10, 2012 2:38 pm
    Thats why I gave you specifics ,we got out of the huge WW2 war debt by growing our economy and having a graduating tax rate that topped at 90%.The economy BOOMED.Since Obama became POTUS the USA has added 1000 MILLIONAIRES a DAY since Obama took office.Its about time they started paying their FAIR SHARE for living and doing business in the USA
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  • It's me! Ha ha! wrote...
    We Americans DO NOT want Obamunism
    December 10, 2012 11:50 am
    we Americans did not vote for it. We voted for real hope and change. Unfortunately all you mindless Left wing Parrots were suckered into re immaculating your Dear Leader and we got what you spineless fools were programmed to vote for!
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  • messiah101 wrote...
    haha
    December 10, 2012 12:28 pm
    Last time I looked YOUR SIDE LOST!We VOTED for Obama (and his policy's) as our nations leader.So again your wrong
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  • Forrest wrote...
    Dear Immaculate Parrot
    December 10, 2012 1:00 pm
    "We Americans DO NOT want Obamunism". If that is so, why did more Americans vote for Obama than Romney? Are you math impaired?
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  • It's me! Ha ha! wrote...
    You people, the good little mindless minions that you are, did get your Dear Leader re immaculated.
    December 10, 2012 2:39 pm
    You Left wing Parrots did exactly what your Dear Leader wanted and you gave this regime FOUR MORE YEARS over us Americans. Which brings me to my point, We Americans DID NOT VOTE FOR THIS LIBERAL INSANITY! We voted for real change. But we failed. Now as a result you Parrots, like the rest of us Americans, must live under this ever expanding umbrella of Obamunism and the hate the racism the Sin filled ever expanding and the ever expanding perversions and all the Wannabe BROWN EYE kissers attempting to garner special favors and treatments from the Supreme Leader that accompany this type of Socialist Utopian dictatorship.

    The only thing that makes me feel a little better about this is that ALL you Useful Idiots have to live with the results of your blind obedience to the regime and your UN accountable Dear Leader along side the rest of us.

    2014!

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  • SeattleD wrote...
    Hey laughing boy
    December 10, 2012 7:44 pm
    You don't laugh no more. That makes me happy.
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  • AtheisticallyYours wrote...
    Win-Lose-Draw
    December 10, 2012 7:59 pm
    Let's see, Obama has been RE-elected to a second term, and CANNOT run for President again (no need to worry about "pissing off" the base there!). Boehner faces re-election EVERY TWO YEARS, and is in a gerrymandered district that he KEEPS GETTING re-elected in (so how is the "base" going to get "pissed off" there?). Maybe the discussion was about what "retiring/defeated" members of the House were gonna get thrown under the bus, and "ordered" to vote "yes" on this thing? No one is gonna win, regardless how it turns out. Its big **** sandwich, and we will ALL have to take a bite
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